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About OrangeJulius

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  1. Loul Deng about to sign extension with the Bulls

    That's my point exactly That would be the guy whom the Bulls need more to succeed. With Rose, Hinrich and Hughes, Gordon is not nearly as necessary an asset to the Bulls as Deng is. Gordon is more of a scorer than those guys, but has proven himself to be pretty one dimensional. That was obvious to Deng and obvious to his agents. They knew that Paxson is willing to tender Gordon, but that he could not tender both Deng and Gordon. Advantage Deng. Now if things had played out and we had hit August 4 and Deng accepted the tender and then Paxson signed Gordon to a similar deal....well THAT would have been a really, really bad deal. Deng is 23 and will likely never be a superstar, but has a chance to be a really, really good overall player. With Gordon, what we've seen is what we're going to get. Hell, strictly on the surface, most recent deals have been "bad". Biedrins got too much. Okafor got too much. But that's how the economics of the NBA work. You have to pay a premium for your key guys, like it or not. And when I say key, that does not necessarily imply best player. It can often refer to a guy who would be very difficult to replace.
  2. Jamar Thread #3

    Classic One piece of evidence you cite is "possible" eyewitness accounts? Using that theory, it would essentially be possible to accuse anyone of anything at anytime.
  3. Loul Deng about to sign extension with the Bulls

    He had plenty of leverage It is very clear that he knows the risk the Bulls would be taking with BOTH Gordon and Deng on one-year tenders. The Bulls simply could not have gone that route and risked losing both players with no compensation in return. No chance. He also knew that they would prefer to sign him over Gordon. It's clearly true that no one out there was going to give him a bigger offer this season. He did make it clear, however, that if he took the tender that he was one and done and that he would not resign with the Bulls next year. Accepting the tender would have made him an unrestricted free agent next year allowing the Bulls no opportunity to match any offers he would get. There's no doubt that Deng would have risked not getting the total comp he just received if he took the tender. But he also knew that the Bulls could not take the risk of allowing both he and Gordon to walk away next year with nothing in return. The latter gave him A LOT of leverage.
  4. Jamar Thread #3

    Still a very tricky one. If Jamar is a full fledged alcoholic, it is highly likely that he would have denied to Weber that he had been drinking again if he was confronted. One of his teammates or someone else associated with the team would have had to rat him out with some direct proof in order to make it a closed case.
  5. Jamar Thread #3

    Rock bottom is a terrible place The notion that a substance abuser has to hit rock bottom in order to develop the motivation to right the ship is an antiquated and rather barbaric one, especially when we're talking about a 19-20 year old kid. Would you feel the same if the person in question was your parent or sibling? Or would you try to offer support to help them get through it? Not everyone is capable of rebounding from rock bottom. None of us know how extensive Jamar's history of abuse is. Based on what the public does know, I don't see how one could take a holier than thou stance that giving him his second chance was an egregious mistake.
  6. Jamar Thread #3

    Correct Phil put it pretty well. You know what? People throughout society give second, third, fourth and on and on ad infinitum in some instances to alcoholics and substance abusers in all walks of life. People with those diagnoses are sick. They are not inherently bad or evil people. They have a disease they have to live with each and every day and it is not an easy one to cope with. Percentages dictate that each one us likely has someone we are close to, either in our immediate families or among our friends, who deals with this issue. Oftentimes, especially with booze, it is not obviously apparent. Should those loved ones never merit a second (or further) chance after screwing up the first time? The powers that be elected to give Jamar a second chance to get his life and hoops career back on track. It appears that he took that opportunity for granted and screwed up royally. The fact that Jamar elected to drink again is completely 100% on his shoulders and he will have to face those consequences. You cannot stop an alcoholic from having a drink short of physical restraint. If he/she is going to do it against all prevailing wisdom, it's going to happen no matter what you tell the person in the form of encouragement. Giving an alcoholic a chance to get things right is nothing to slam. Hindsight makes anyone sound like a genius. They took a chance on giving him another opportunity and now everyone involved will have to deal with the consequences. Jamar will likely see his once promising career at Illinois end and Weber and Guenther will have to deal with the impact that this has on the program. They invested a lot of time and effort into integrating him into what we were going to do next season and now it looks like it was all in vain.
  7. Loul Deng about to sign extension with the Bulls

    Of course Of course the Bulls would have preferred a much shorter deal. But Deng was not going to accept a shorter deal. He used the Gordon situation as leverage. The Bulls are not in a position to let BOTH Deng and Gordon walk after next season. They would really be starting over if they did that. They clearly need Deng more than Gordon and Luol used that to get a sweet long term deal. The only choice that the Bulls had other than doing this deal was to find a fair trade for him, but other teams are also aware of their situation and any offers were probably pretty one-sided. Re: the mention of Deron's deal in another post.....that was a relatively short 3-year deal because Deron wanted it to be that way. Same as Lebron and Wade did with their deals. After 3 years, they can either sign monster deals to finish where they are or else look to leave as a free agent to a better situation. All of those guys are on the upper tier of NBA players and they want to retain some flexibility. In the reverse of a guy like Deng, their teams would have preferred to have signed them to 6+ year deals if the players would have gone along.
  8. Okafor, Bobcats agree to 6-year, $72 million deal

    Depends on supply and demand For solid and mobile bigs like Okafor and Biedrins, there is a woefully short supply in the NBA. Thus, the demand is much greater and they need to pay them $10M per or else lose them to another suitor. Gordon is going to begin to realize what an enormous mistake he made turning down the offer last year. His limitations are obvious and he is not going to get $10M+ per year from any team in the NBA. He's a specialist streak shooter who can't really guard the big 2s in the league effectively. I think the Europe threat is hot air in his case. However, I wouldn't be at all surprised to see him take the qualifying offer this year and then become an unrestricted free agent next summer. He'll learn that the market values him very differently from how he and his agent see things.
  9. Meyers Leonard commits to Illinois

    One way or the other Considering that he is listed at 6'10" a mere 9 months later, that was not him you saw or else Meyer's growth plates are hella open.
  10. Europe vs. the NBA

    Extend, yes. More money, no. The soccer players coming from Europe to the US to finish out their careers are stars on their last legs. They may make a lot in endorsements, but their salaries, for the most part, are far less than what they were earning in Europe. To contrast, we're now seeing a US basketball player not yet in his prime leaving for Europe in order to make more money. And not just a little bit more, but a good deal more money. Now I wouldn't be surprised to see NBA stars past their prime look to head to Europe for their last season or two in the future. In most cases, though, they'd be doing so for less money than they would get in the NBA and they'd likely not find too much in terms of endorsements over there.
  11. Europe vs. the NBA

    Not even close If that were the case, then the US soccer team would be winning world championships on a regular basis. European basketball is far ahead of US soccer at this point in time.
  12. Europe vs. the NBA

    First it was Brandon Jennings shunning the NCAA to head to Europe and now word has it that there is a very good chance that Josh Childress is going to sign a deal in Greece that will pay him more than any NBA team will. It will be interesting to see if this is merely a short term trend or a sign of more to come. Both Jennings' and Childress' moves would be unprecedented. There have been Euro players in the NBA who went back at the end of their careers and US guys who did the same, but I can't recall a player with a solid NBA career ever jumping to Europe as he is considering doing. http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/news;_ylt=Ai4L...=yhoo&type=lgns
  13. Whoever called the tall Euro guy in the 2nd was right.

    CDR is vastly overrated by this board His standing in the draft last night is pretty clear evidence of that.
  14. NBA Draft Rumor Thread

    There is a catch The deal assumes that Rose, Beasley and Mayo are selected 1-3. If that does not occur, the trade is off. Seems like a strange deal as Gordon, by all indications, is going to be available to them with their own #7 pick.
  15. NBA Draft Rumor Thread

    Riley knows what he's seen and heard from Beasley Riley loves guys who place winning above all else and he simply doesn't see that in Beasley. He had teams full of such guys in LA and NY. Wade is willing to leave a few body parts on the floor if it will win the game. Beasley is a fun loving kid who likes to pull pranks on his teammates and doesn't seem to take things too seriously. That doesn't mean he won't end up being a great player, but it does mean that he isn't the kind of guy that Riley can stomach easily. He already has one such guy like that in Marion. The thought of having to depend on two of them in the lineup each night is enough to give him an ulcer.