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Mike White Years

#61 User is offline   nichi 

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Posted 07 July 2010 - 08:49 PM

View PostIllinigrad, on Jul 7 2010, 04:58 PM, said:

He was fired for cheating and he was not burnt out. He may have looked it but he was still a young guy. He went on to demanding coaching gigs in the NFL. That encourages burnout 24/7.


Published: January 19, 1988 /www.nytimes.com

Quote

CHAMPAIGN, Ill., Jan. 18 Mike White, the head football coach at the University of Illinois, resigned today following an investigation by the National Collegiate Athletic Association into purported recruiting violations, a university spokeswoman said.

Judith Rowan, associate chancellor for public affairs, said one of the allegations involved payment for lodging to a prospective athlete by an assistant coach. Rowan said the athlete enrolled at another university and the assistant coach was no longer at Illinois. She declined to identify either of them.

Rowan said a December letter from the N.C.A.A. cited three alleged infractions, two of which the N.C.A.A. said did not appear serious.

''We are fully committed to compliance to N.C.A.A. regulations,'' said Morton Weir, the interim chancellor. ''The athletic association board of directors, and I, believe that Coach White has responded appropriately by tendering his resignation.''

White said late tonight that even though the alleged infractions were minor he accepted blame for them.

He had a record of 47-41-3 in eight years at Illinois. His 1983 team won the Big Ten title but lost in the Rose Bowl. The football program was placed on probation in 1984 because of N.C.A.A. rule violations.



1986 Illinois 47 35
1987 Illinois 371 251

Judge for yourself. That second investigation killed a strong recruiting class. I doubt he was going to turn it around. It was time for a change, NCAA or not. Meanwhile, Neale Stoner had the stadium crew going yard work at his house, on the clock, and thought it was just a normal perk. His assistant Vance Redfern was later involved in the mess at SDSU. They 'resigned' at UI in July 1988.
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#62 User is offline   Eric C. Loy 

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Posted 07 July 2010 - 09:18 PM

View PostIllinigrad, on Jul 7 2010, 04:58 PM, said:

He was fired for cheating and he was not burnt out. He may have looked it but he was still a young guy. He went on to demanding coaching gigs in the NFL. That encourages burnout 24/7.


Demanding coaching gigs do not get tougher than working for Al Davis I bet.
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#63 User is offline   illiniflight33 

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Posted 07 July 2010 - 10:13 PM

View Postnichi, on Jul 7 2010, 02:44 PM, said:

I was terribly confused about the actual violations, and was thirty-something at the time. There was some talk about the use of a travel agency that was a donor, to fly in JuCo recruits from CA. Also, housing them at the Old Chancellor {sp?} Hotel that was technically off campus. That was public information. nothing they tried to hide. Also, as someone noted, the recruits named were guys that never got admitted to school or played. Of course, those were the guys that talked, at least that was the perception of some observers.

That said, the AD, Neale Stoner {aptly named?} played by his own rules and ticked off a lot of Illini insiders. I think the NCAA figured something was going on; they just could not prove it. So they found borderline technical violations and exaggerated them. Stoner, who ran the DIA like his own fiefdom, was eventually brought down by people that worked under him.

As for White, I do not think he was fired for cheating. His recruiting classes, and he had a monster one committed, got kayoed. His coaching slipped and he looked really burnt out. He really had to go.


There were a couple of incidents. Its been a long time, so I dont recall the exact details in full.

First incident was Dave Wilson, who sued the NCAA (And technically the U of I), so that he could play. There were some questions about his ability to redshirt while in Junior College, and some transcript issues. IE classes that the NCAA didnt want to have allowed for the purposes of transferring/eligibility. I forget the exact scenario, but basically the NCAA was being really punitive on a technicality.

Elton and Delton iirc. Kids came from California on a recruiting visit, didnt have coats and it was like January. NCAA started to snoop around.

There was also Hart Lee Dykes, one of the assistants tried to hide the kid in a hotel and there were some illegal contacts etc. IIRC there were violations, but the violations were really minor.


After those incidents, and while we were on probation. White/Illinois paid for the meal/lodging for a sibling of a recruit. The kid was special needs, and the family had to give care 24/7. The mere act of paying for the kids meals were considered illegal by the NCAA, and ended up being the straw that broke the camels back and White was fired.

There were a few other violations, but basically they totaled out to a fair number of minor violations. IE White skirting the rules, but there was not some sort of massive under the table cash payments.
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#64 User is offline   Illinigrad 

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Posted 07 July 2010 - 11:36 PM

Flight has it right. Any of the White violations were really minor, nickle and dime stuff, much like the 60s Slush fund, which also was nick and dimes. The latter was actually much less than what other conference schools were doing, UI just happened to get caught. The transcript issue with Wilson was that there was another Dave Wilson at the same college in CA the the FB Dave Wilson played at. The school sent the wrong transcript or UI get the two mixed up which resulted in an unfair accusation that UI was trying to do something illegal. Considering the high academic standards UI maintained, higher than most of the conference schools, it was totally ridiculous. Bo at MI was out to get White and he stopped at nothing to try and keep White and IL down.
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#65 User is offline   carmelillini 

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Posted 08 July 2010 - 11:25 AM

View PostBZuppke, on Jul 2 2010, 02:16 PM, said:

I have two bottles of Rose Bowl Illini Pepsi (unopened).

I have another.
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#66 User is offline   BZuppke 

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Posted 08 July 2010 - 02:44 PM

With Hart Lee Dykes, three schools were put on probation (Okla, Okla St and Illinois) and two coaches (Pat Jones at Okla St and Mike White) lost their jobs. The major violation was that Rick George, assistant football coach under White got Dykes to commit to Illinois over the Oklahoma schools. The Oklahoma schools were hounding Dykes to decommit on the last day or so of recruiting and Dykes complained to George that he was getting death threats and under tremendous pressure to decommit. On impulse, George gave him $100.00 to stay at a hotel overnight so he could get away from it all until commitment day (the next morning). One of my law professors who helped defend Illinois with the NCAA said Rick George was a really decent and honest guy who after landing one of the top recruits in the US at that time used poor judgment and committed the violation on impulse (This law professor told me the detailed facts I outlined above). White was unaware of it. That was the one significant violation in Jan 1988 that forced White to resign. It was the third run in with the NCAA and the NCAA just wouldn't let up until White was gone. When you look at it yes it was a violation but White did not encourage nor was he even part of this and most of the other (minor) violations. The NCAA was out to get us because Stoner stepped on a lot of toes and Schembechler ( and some others including George Perles at MSU) hated White and the fact that he was resurrecting Illinois. White was a marked man who essentially had to run a program that was the cleanest in America in order to stay alive. The whole thing was very unfortunate for us, because White was probably "the guy" who was going to make us a consistent winner and not because he cheated, but because he was a great coach.
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#67 User is offline   dwc13 

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Posted 08 July 2010 - 07:48 PM

Illinois needs an administration (Chancellor, Trustees, AD) that is committed towards all-around excellence for the univesity -- including the athletic program -- and not one from the Univeristy of Chicago mold (academics and athletics don't mix). That needs to happen before things can really change for the better before a consistent winner/contender in football can be realized.

It can be done. Who had ever heard of Rutgers football before Greg Schiano took over? Northwestern was an all-time disaster in football (and most other sports) until Gary Barnett took over. Same with Kansas State until Bill Snyder took over (1st time). Illinois has access to better resources and facilities than those other programs, but the UofI administration is too often willing to settle for average/accept mediocrity when it comes to athletics. And until that attitude changes, it's going to be tough for the football program to win consistently in C-U.

Anyone got Mike Leach's phone number?!
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#68 User is offline   Illinigrad 

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Posted 08 July 2010 - 09:53 PM

View Postdwc13, on Jul 8 2010, 06:48 PM, said:

Anyone got Mike Leach's phone number?!


How about Mike White's phone number! Fire Zook and bring him back even if only for one year. Let the good times roll.
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#69 User is offline   dwc13 

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Posted 09 July 2010 - 01:29 AM

View PostIllinigrad, on Jul 8 2010, 09:53 PM, said:

How about Mike White's phone number! Fire Zook and bring him back even if only for one year. Let the good times roll.



Do you really want double secret probation this time?!

I don't think you want to hire anyone who has already been subjected to working for Al Davis as head coach of the Oakland Raiders (and is available).

Tom Cable
Lane Kiffin
Art Shell
Norv Turner
Bill Callahan
John Gruden
Joe Bugel
Mike White
Art Shell
Mike Shananhan
Tom Flores

Of this group, Flores (2), Shanahan (2), and Gruden (1) have won the SuperBowl. Flores has long since retired from coaching. Shanahan had a great run in Denver and is now the Redskins head coach. Gruden won the SuperBowl his 1st season as coach of Tampa Bay -- and that was a team really put together by Tony Dungy. Gruden only had 1 other good season (11-5 in 2005) as the Buccaneers coach and finished 57-55 despite going 12-4 his first season.

Norv Turner has had 2 pretty good seasons sandwiched around an 8-8 year, having taken over a strong team from Marty Schottenheimer. He has yet to win a playoff game (0-3) as head coach of the Chargers -- like I said, taken over from Schottenheimer. Besides, Illinois has already had his brother Ron Turner as head coach and you know how well that one worked out...

Bill Callahan -- The worst coach in Nebraska history as far as I am concerned. How someone could wreck @40 years of non-losing seasons and tradition so quickly is beyond comprehension. He should be persona non grata in Big Ten Country. I wouldn't wish him on Michigan, although in all fairness UM might already have its version of Callahan.

Lane Kiffin is the coaching equivalent of "one-and-done". No thanks.

Joe Bugel was a great offensive line coach but a horrible head coach. Where have I heard that one before? Besides, he's @70.

Mike White had his time in C-U and it sounds like a few people pine for those days. I think he's content watching football from the livingroom. Time to move forward.
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#70 User is offline   uieightythree 

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Posted 11 July 2010 - 08:34 AM

we want Randy Edsall
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#71 User is offline   Illinifandan 

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Posted 14 July 2010 - 04:28 PM

View Postuieightythree, on Jul 11 2010, 08:34 AM, said:

we want Randy Edsall

Wayne Fonts, aka Rasputin, is still available.

BTW & FYI, a quick check on Wikipedia revealed that Mike White turned 74 in January '10, FWIW.
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#72 User is offline   BZuppke 

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Posted 14 July 2010 - 05:09 PM

http://sports.espn.g...tory?id=5380112

Boy this is similar to what happened at Illlinois. Bet they don't get banned from bowl games nor is their coach forced to resign.
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#73 User is offline   Illinifandan 

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Posted 14 July 2010 - 05:14 PM

View PostBZuppke, on Jul 14 2010, 05:09 PM, said:

http://sports.espn.g...tory?id=5380112

Boy this is similar to what happened at Illlinois. Bet they don't get banned from bowl games nor is their coach forced to resign.

Yep, just saw that. This almost needs a new thread.
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#74 User is offline   3n1 

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Posted 14 July 2010 - 07:48 PM

View PostBZuppke, on Jul 8 2010, 02:44 PM, said:

With Hart Lee Dykes, three schools were put on probation (Okla, Okla St and Illinois) and two coaches (Pat Jones at Okla St and Mike White) lost their jobs. The major violation was that Rick George, assistant football coach under White got Dykes to commit to Illinois over the Oklahoma schools. The Oklahoma schools were hounding Dykes to decommit on the last day or so of recruiting and Dykes complained to George that he was getting death threats and under tremendous pressure to decommit. On impulse, George gave him $100.00 to stay at a hotel overnight so he could get away from it all until commitment day (the next morning). One of my law professors who helped defend Illinois with the NCAA said Rick George was a really decent and honest guy who after landing one of the top recruits in the US at that time used poor judgment and committed the violation on impulse (This law professor told me the detailed facts I outlined above). White was unaware of it. That was the one significant violation in Jan 1988 that forced White to resign. It was the third run in with the NCAA and the NCAA just wouldn't let up until White was gone. When you look at it yes it was a violation but White did not encourage nor was he even part of this and most of the other (minor) violations. The NCAA was out to get us because Stoner stepped on a lot of toes and Schembechler ( and some others including George Perles at MSU) hated White and the fact that he was resurrecting Illinois. White was a marked man who essentially had to run a program that was the cleanest in America in order to stay alive. The whole thing was very unfortunate for us, because White was probably "the guy" who was going to make us a consistent winner and not because he cheated, but because he was a great coach.

I second everything in your post, Zup. I was in law school then, too and will never be that close to the program again. I had several friends on the team and found Craver and several other profs who were willing to talk about White, Wilson, and the NCAA vendetta. I don't like the way people say White was dirty with so little to back it up. I was there, and if I didn't know more about what was going on than E. Loy I quit. I had a friend who played football with Rick George in high school and defended him to the end. It was a great time to be at Uof I, but the trip home from the Rose Bowl with a massive hangover was not much fun. IMO $100 for Dykes would not be "significant" now.

I have two words for those who think White couldn't have put the program back near the top: Jeff George. I wish White could have coached those teams. So does George and his family.
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#75 User is offline   Illinigrad 

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Posted 14 July 2010 - 10:07 PM

View PostIllinifandan, on Jul 14 2010, 04:28 PM, said:

Wayne Fonts, aka Rasputin, is still available.

BTW & FYI, a quick check on Wikipedia revealed that Mike White turned 74 in January '10, FWIW.



Wow, how time passes! Even at 74, I bet White would churn out more wins with current talent (and also the talent of the 07 and 08 seasons) than Zook and company have.
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#76 User is offline   Illinigrad 

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Posted 14 July 2010 - 10:09 PM

View Post3n1, on Jul 14 2010, 07:48 PM, said:

I have two words for those who think White couldn't have put the program back near the top: Jeff George. I wish White could have coached those teams. So does George and his family.


Yep. Virtually everything about the UI FB program has been mishandled. White would have been a terrific success at IL and also a lifer. Too bad Stoner felt differently.
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